Benedict XVI - Pope Emeritus?
Wow. No one saw this one coming... I am deeply saddenned by Pope Benedict XVI's announcement today that he is to abdicate the papacy. He has been a truly good and holy Pope, and is one of the world's greatest living theologians. Benedict has always been a reluctant pontiff, and many parallels are going to be drawn with St. Celestine V - another pope who resigned the Petrine Office. Interestingly, as I note in page 42 of Unveiling the Apocalypse, the various prophecies of the Angelic Pope were directly based on the example of Pope Saint Celestine V - a holy old hermit who was reluctantly elected to the papacy, and subsequently abidicated. Also, according to some variants of the prophecies of the Pastor Angelicus, there would in fact be several "angelic popes" towards the end of the world. But the focus of these prophecies has always been on the coming of a pope who would heal the Church of schism and bring about the Second Pentecost. Rather amazingly, the Worthy Shepherd Prophecy, attributed to Blessed Tomasuccio de Foligno, predicted that the Angelic Pope who heals the Church of schism would be elected by "about twelve years shall the millennium have passed":
"One from beyond the mountains shall become the Vicar Of God. Religious and clerics shall take part in this change. Outside the true path, there will be only disreputable men; I shrug my shoulders when the Bark of Peter is in danger and there is no one to lend it help... The schismatic shall fall into the scorn of the Italian faithful... By about twelve years shall the millennium have passed when the resplendent mantle of legitimate power shall emerge from the shadows where it was being kept by the schism. And beyond harm from the one who is blocking the door of salvation, for his deceitful schism shall have come to an end. And the mass of the faithful shall attach itself to the worthy Shepherd, who shall extricate each one from error and restore to the Church its beauty. He shall renew it."
The Worthy Shepherd Prophecy is cited in a book called Miscellanea Francescana 1, edited by M. Faloci Pulignani, dating to 1886. This book in turn appears to base at least some of its information on a facsimile dating to the late 15th century called Legenda de' Beati del Terzo Ordine Sancto Francisco, (ed L. Temperini, Rome: Editrice Franciscanum, 1996), which contains the Legenda of Bl. Tomasuccio de Foligno - as recorded by his companion and disciple Giusto della Rosa.
The first known prophecy of the Angelic Pope, or pastor angelicus, was cited by the English polymath Roger Bacon in the 13th century:
...Forty years ago it was prophesied, and there have been many visions to the same effect, that there will be a pope in these times who will purify Canon Law and the Church of God from the sophistries and deceits of the jurists so that justice will reign over all without the rumbling of lawsuits. Because of the goodness, truth, and justice of this pope the Greeks will return to the obedience of the Roman Church, the greater part of the Tartars will be converted to the faith, and the Saracens will be destroyed. There will be one flock and one shepherd, as the prophet heard (John 10:16)...
(Taken from Roger Bacon's The Third Work. Trans. by B McGinn Visions of the End (New York, Columbia, 1998) p190)
The Angelic Pope of medieval prophecy was foretold to heal the schism with the Eastern Othrodox Church (which echoes the conversion of Russia prophesied at Fatima). Later, the pastor angelicus prophecies would also be connected to the reunfication of the schismatic Protestant churches with Rome, as well as the future conversion of England - such as foretold in the original 1846 Church-approved version of the secrets of La Salette:
The faith will die out in France: three quarters of France will not practice religion anymore, or almost no more, the other part will practice it without really practicing it. Then, after [that], nations will convert, the faith will be rekindled everywhere. A great country, now Protestant, in the north of Europe, will be converted; by the support of this country all the other nations of the world will be converted.
Before all that arrives, great disorders will arrive, in the Church, and everywhere. Then, after [that], our Holy Father the Pope will be persecuted. His successor will be a pontiff that nobody expects.
Then, after [that], a great peace will come, but it will not last a long time. A monster will come to disturb it.
(See here for the full text)
In a post written in Jan 2013 (which can be found here), I attempted to show how the Worthy Shepherd Prophecy may be connected to the 2000th anniversary of the Finding in the Temple, which will be celebrated this Easter - which we now know will be at around the same time as the election of the new pope.
I'll post the relevant material below:
In addition to the above correlations, it is interesting to note that the year 2013 will mark the 2000th anniversary of the finding of Jesus in the Temple (the fifth Joyful Mystery of the Rosary), after the Holy Family had lost the adolescent Christ (the third sorrow of Mary). If Jesus was one on 25th December 1AD, his twelfth birthday would have been celebrated on 25th December 12AD, making the Passover of 2013 the 2000th anniversary of the Finding in the Temple. Although modern scholarship has suggested that the actual year of Jesus' birth may have been some years earlier, Catholics still use the Anno Domini numbering system to celebrate anniversaries and jubilees connected to the life of Jesus. So the Anno Domini system still retains the primary symbolic value for Christians, given that we have no other uncontested means of celebrating anniversaries surrounding the life of Christ.
Many scholars believe that the boy Jesus had been taken to Jerusalem at this point to mark his Bar Mitzvah. A Bar or Bat Miztvah is a Jewish coming of age ceremony which is today celebrated once a child has turned 13 - a point in life where children are considered responsible for their actions, and thus a "son of the commandments" - which is the meaning of the Hebrew/Aramaic word Bar Mitzvah (Bar and Bat means "son" and "daughter" respectively, while Mitzvah means "commandments"). Once they had reached the age of accountability, adolescent children were expected to live by the commandments given to Moses in the Torah. Some commentators suggest that Jesus would have been among the scholars in the Temple during this pilgrimage in order to receive instruction on how to properly live the commandments of Jewish law. But the teachers were amazed at Jesus' understanding of the Scriptures when he began to expound to them their true meaning:
Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the Feast of the Passover. And when he was twelve years old, they went up according to custom. And when the feast was ended, as they were returning, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem. His parents did not know it, but supposing him to be in the group they went a day's journey, but then they began to search for him among their relatives and acquaintances, and when they did not find him, they returned to Jerusalem, searching for him. After three days they found him in the temple, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. And all who heard him were amazed at his understanding and his answers.
(Luke 2:41-47)
Christ among
the Doctors of the Law, Paolo Caliari, (16th
century)
The Jewish custom of the Bar Mitzvah, is analogous to the sacrament of confirmation in Catholicism (when we receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit), given that both rituals are conferred around adolescence - the age of reason or accountability. So we can only hope and pray that during the Year of Faith in 2013, the Church will receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit promised during the Second Pentecost, which will usher in the beginning of the age in which the fortunes of the Church will be restored; and like Mary and Joseph, the former world of Christendom will find the Christ who has been lost to it. Maybe upon this renewed discovery of Christ, we too will be "amazed at his understanding and his answers", when the hidden meaning of Scripture is revealed to the doctors of the Church.
This would then tie in rather nicely with the "Worthy Shepherd Prophecy" of Bl. Tomasuccio de Foligno, which also places the Second Pentecost to around this time period - by "about twelve years shall the millennium have passed"...
...I originally thought that this prophecy pointed to the year 2012. But someone has highlighted the fact that the words "about twelve years shall the millennium have passed" would single out the year 2013, rather than 2012, as twelve years would have passed (i.e. reached completion) since the millennium, bringing us up to the end of the year 2012 and into 2013...
We can now see in retrospect that the words by "about twelve years shall the millennium have passed" could mean just over twelve years past the millennium, which amazingly will be the precise date of the next papal election, around Easter 2013 - the 2000th anniversary of the Finding in the Temple. What an extraordinary grace it would be if the doctors of the Church are guided by the presense of the Living Christ to elect the "Worthy Shepherd" this Easter, so that the Church may finally "all be one":
“I do not ask for these only, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me. The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, I in them and you in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that you sent me and loved them even as you loved me."
(John 17:20-23)
"Puis Gaston Georgel évoque la célèbre prophétie des Papes, dite aussi Prophétie de saint Malachie, à laquelle Raoul Auclair a consacré un de ses livres (paru en 1969). On sait que ce texte, attribué à saint Malachie, contemporain et disciple de saint Bernard, énumère, à partir de Célestin II (1143-1144), une liste de cent onze devises papales successives. Le précédent pape, Jean-Paul II était associé à la devise De labore solis, et le pape actuel, Benoît XVI à la devise De gloria olivae. Après devrait régner Pierre le Romain, qui sera le dernier pontife de l’histoire. Une série de médaillons présente la suite des pontifes romains au haut d’une frise qui fait le tour du vaste quadrilatère de la basilique Saint-Paul-hors-les-murs à Rome ; il était très impressionnant de voir, tout à la fin du pontificat de Jean-Paul II, les deux dernières places encore vides… Raoul Auclair a mis en évidence que la 73e devise (Axis in medietate signi) indique le milieu chronologique de la prophétie ; cette devise est associé à Sixte Quint, dont le milieu du règne tombe en 1587. Entre le départ de la prophétie (1143) et 1587, il s’est écoulé 444 ans ( 4 x 111 ans) ; on peut en conclure que la fin doit se situer 444 ans après 1587, soit en 2031."
ReplyDeletehttp://ridoux.fr/spip/spip.php?article122
Merci beaucoup, c'est très intéressant ...
ReplyDeleteThankyou Emmett for addressing the situation at hand so promptly. I ask prayers for Benedict and our future pope...whoever it may be. I have a "gut feeling" that this papal election may indeed spawn a progressive liberal "anti pope" and challenge the legal and authentic pope who will be left with a much smaller Church. It will be a time of derision and apostacy. This purification must be accomplished. He will call and we will know his voice. Thankyou again... as you are a fascinating read. James of Nashville
ReplyDeleteAlso the New Millenium did not start until 2001, not 2000 which was the last year of the previous millenium.
ReplyDeleteMy math tells me that if Our Lord was born in the year 1 A.D. then in the year 12 A.D. He was only 11.
ReplyDeleteI don't think Jesus was really born in 1 AD, though. The most reliable, believable scenario I have seen has him being born in the fall of 2 BC, with the visitation of the Magi being in early winter of 1 BC.
ReplyDeleteThanks for this analysis, Emmett!
Hi Anon 2,
ReplyDeleteActually, you're right - I'll have to amend this post to suit. The lack of year zero has always been a bug-bear of mine. According to popular tradition, Jesus was 33 when he died. And the most likely date of the Crucifixion was 33AD. So I think people tend to imagine Christ being 33 on 33AD.
But I would agree with Dave also, that Jesus was actually born earlier, during the reign of King Herod. As I say above, it is the symbolism of the Anno Domini calendar that counts here.
Emmet,
ReplyDeleteCan you elaborate on the St. Malachy prophecies? I believe in your book, you called them into some question. In advance, thank you for your response.
Emmet,
ReplyDeleteDidn't you write that the martyr pope is Pope Benedict? Perhaps I misunderstood. But, if that is the case, how will he be the martyr pope if he will now no longer be pope?
Please clarify my ignorance on this.
thanks!
rose
Hi Rose,
ReplyDeleteI speculated that St. Malachy's motto for Pope Benedict XVI - "glory of the olives", could identify him as being one of "the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth."
(Rev 11:4). So this was purely based on the St. Malachy prophecies, which I also call into question in the book. I think the rest will answer your question also Jason. St. Malachy's list of popes was most likely a pseudonymous work dating to around the time of its first publication, given the fact that there were a greater number of prophetic hits before it was published. After it was published, the mottoes become rather more obscure, right up to the 20th century - where they become very accurate again. So there is still the possibility that some of the mottoes are prophetic in nature (although I hope not!), but I don't think they are the authentic writings of St. Malachy.
I still believe that the prophecy of the Two Witnesses in Rev 11 is connected to the Angelic Pope and Great Monarch of Catholic prophecy, and thus to the various prophecies of the martyr-pope - given the fact that the Two Witnesses are killed by the Antichrist:
"And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that rises from the bottomless pit will make war on them and conquer them and kill them, and their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city that symbolically is called Sodom and Egypt, where their Lord was crucified."
(Rev 11:7-8)
In the book, I note the similarities to the Two Witnesses being killed in the "great city" where "their Lord was crucified", to the pope of the Third Secret being killed in a city with a large cross on top. The only thing that would link Pope Benedict XVI to the Two Witnesses is the St. Malachy prophecy. But it would actually make a lot more sense if the martyr-pope is going to be another different pope contemporary with the Antichrist. It was always something that didn't seem to fit to me if Pope Benedict were to be the martyr-pope of various prophecies - since I believe that the reign of the Antichrist is still some way off. The Second Pentecost must take place before the arrival of the Antichrist, and the Book of Revelation states that he is ultimately responsible for putting the Two Witnesses to death.
Given that Pope Benedict has resigned though, this opens up another intriguing possibility - that Pope Benedict would live to see the arrival of "the glory of the olives". But again, we have to be careful about putting too much scope in St. Malachy's list of popes - especially since they are not among the Church-approved private revelations.
I'll have to cover this in more detail in a proper blog post.
Very informative. Thanks for the post!
ReplyDeleteThank you and Ilook forward to reading your book. Its surreal to watch so much prophecy unfolding.brooke
ReplyDeleteI think we tend to look at St. Malachys prophecy in a way that Peter the Roman must be the last Pope ever. "In the final persecution of the Holy Roman Church there will reign Peter the Roman, who will feed his flock amid many tribulations, after which the seven-hilled city will be destroyed and the dreadful Judge will judge the people. The End." In my opinion i don't see that this prophecy says that. To me it seems that Peter the Roman will be Pontiff During the beginning of the Final Persecution of the Church, which seem to begin before the era of Peace and end when the Anti Christ is destroyed. It also says "after which" etc. etc. This all indicates to me that Peter the Roman (the next pope) will not only be pope when these persecutions and tribulations begin but will lead the Church into the New Springtime.
ReplyDeleteThere very well may be more popes afterwards. I think the prophecys purpose is not to tell us the end will come now, I think the purpose is to warn us when the real deal begins.
Also to me whether or not these prophecies are St. Malachys or not doesn't matter. They may have been obscure for a time but the whole reason for these Prophecies in the first place is to show the Faithful when to expect the events to be set in motion for the end.
Emmett I don't think these Prophecies contradict your writings at all, in this understanding to me I can clearly see them fit together.
The Glory of the Olive still fits Pope Benedict XVI just based on the name that he chose and how he has set in motion the Re Unification of the Church and the New Springtime.
ReplyDeleteThe Martyr Pope to me could very well be this next pope seeing as how he's Connected to St. Peter by the name "Peter" the Roman and St. Peter was Martyred himself. Just a thought...
Thanks Fran and Brooke!
ReplyDeleteHi Joe,
Yes, Peter the Roman would tie in well with the martyr-pope prophecies. Especially given the fact that it states he will reign during the final persecution (which takes place under the Antichrist). The fact that St. Peter was martyred is an interesting connection also. I'll try to cover this subject in more detail in my next post...
Hi Emmett,
ReplyDeleteI have two questions:
Pius X had a vision of the martyr pope whom he said would "be of the same name". Do you think this next pope will be Pius XIII?
Do you think that Cardinal Turkson is "Peter the Roman"?
From the Warning Second Coming messages, Jesus said that Pope Benedict was the last Pope and that the next pope elected would be the false pope who would be in union with the antichrist. Jesus said that St. Peter will lead his flock from the heavens during the rein of the antipope. After the antichrist is destroyed by our Blessed Mother, St. Peter will lead the faithful into the new era of peace.
ReplyDeleteHi Anon 1,
ReplyDeleteI find the prophecy attributed to Pope St. Pius X intriguing, given its similarities to the Third Secret. But I can't find it mentioned anywhere in any official documents, which suggests that it is an apocryphal prophecy at best. I'd love to find the original source. I always thought that if it was geniune then it could refer to a pope named Pius XIII.
I really have no idea who will be elected. But I think the name "Peter the Roman" could be applied to just about any pope, if he were truly to be the last pontiff. It would mean he would be pope during the Second Coming, just as Peter was made pope by Our Lord during his ministry on earth. Also as Joe Russo notes above, if the next pope is the martyr-pope of various prophecies, then this would tie into St. Peter being the first pope to be martyred.
Anon 2,
Maria Divine Mercy's messages contain serious doctrinal errors. I wouldn't pay attention to them.
Hi Emmett,
ReplyDeleteSo what are the doctrinal errors from the messages of Maria Divine Mercy?
Just a few notes on Maria Divine Mercy - this alleged seer teaches the doctrine of millenarianism (i.e. a future period of a thousand years of peace), and that sins can be forgiven through prayer rather than the sacrament of confession. She also claims to be able to dispense plenary indulgences. She probably believes herself to be genuine, but fails to "test the spirits", as instructed by St. John:
ReplyDelete"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world". (1John 4:1)
A pope with the name Pius will clean up the church no doubt. Pius' to me seem no nonsense types.
ReplyDeleteI personally believe someone who will clean up the liturgy is the person to lead the church out of the abyss and the most likely of proposed candidates I can see on that front would be Cardinal Burke. I can't envisage a second pentecost in the west whilst the ordinary form of the liturgy remains as is. Perhaps the second pentecost will largely take place in Asian/African countries where the church is currently growing. Cardinal Burke also seems the strongest spoken on critical issues such as denying communion to pro abort politicians.
Turkson may have eliminated himself from the process with the recent interview where he came across somewhat as pushing his own case.
A nice piece by Michael Voris on the pontificate of B16:
http://www.churchmilitant.tv/daily/?today=2013-02-10
With B16 you got the feeling it wasn't about him one iota he didn't get much credit from the outside world (one journo here with no idea said "good person, poor pope") where everything is about personality and charm but as Joe Russo mentioned strong action was taken to setup the church going forward on many fronts. I liked his vision of a smaller but more devout church.
Hi Emmett,
ReplyDeleteI disagree with you concerning Maria Divine Mercy. First, I am a devout Catholic and I have prayed many novenas concerning the authenticity of the messages. I have gotten a resounding "yes" from Jesus that these messages are divine. And Jesus gave a plenary indulgance as a gift to the entire human race, but He also urged Catholics to go to confession. In fact He tells Catholics to go to confession all of the time. Jesus said that the contents of the book of Revelations is unknown to man. He is now explaining through MDM the meaning of Revelations. No man knows about the Era of Peace. But Jesus is explaining about this Era through MDM. I do not see any doctrinal errors. If Jesus wants to give the whole human race a plenary indulgance, He most certainly can. He KNOWS that our generation needs a special grace. When I was born, pornography was abundant and 3 years after I was born, the government legalized abortion. The medical community supported birth control and never gave a second thought about it being a sin. So, I was born into a world infested with sin that was made out to be acceptable by the world of medicine and entertainment. God is giving this generation special graces. We have the Divine Mercy Chaplet to pray for the dying. God is so merciful to this generation and He has given us these special messages to prepare us for the future. I believe in them and I am a person to trust, especially discerning evil from the divine.
First time Ive read your Blog Emmett O'Reagan. I find your work on Unveiling the Apocalypse thought provoking and refreshing. I cannot tell you how many prophecies Ive read and how far they are from truth, most having doctrinal errors. I mean they are just out there. The only ones with some truths are the revelations from early centuries just like the ones you write about. And of course Church approved apparitions of our lady.
ReplyDeleteIve been trying to find a blog to follow with end of times information and yours seems to be factual...Thanks for all the work...God Bless You.
"I cannot tell you how many prophecies Ive read and how far they are from truth, most having doctrinal errors. I mean they are just out there. The only ones with some truths are the revelations from early centuries just like the ones you write about. And of course Church approved apparitions of our lady."
ReplyDeleteSpot on. When God has a major revelation/message to share with mankind they are mainly accompanied by a huge irrefutable public miracle - see Fatima, Zeitoun or Akita. In Akita the statue wept 101 times, shed blood and perfumed the sanctuary captured by television camera and attested to by atheists, agnostics, Buddhists and Catholics alike. Sr Sasagawa received her own miraculous healing from deafness that was independently verified.
St John of the Cross one of the greatest doctors of the church had visions of Jesus Christ, angels, the devil and eventually wasn't sure if a "heavenly" visit was of Jesus or the devil himself and asked the apparitions to cease. This is one of the greatest mystics and minds of the church - imagine what chance a layperson has of discerning the difference between a heavenly or diabolical voice that descends upon them. Soon as they hear a voice unfortunately they think God is speaking to them. Be discerning friends.
There are many people coming back into the church from the Warning messages. They are going to confession, praying for many souls and the church, etc. Jesus gave a healing prayer to pray and said that many people would be healed from reciting it. There will be miracles happening and there have been miracles performed from the Warning messages. Remember, through these messages, many souls are being saved form hell. That is difficult to prove just like it is difficult to prove if a particular soul was saved from hell through the recitation of the divine mercy chaplet. Jesus has given every person on this earth the graces to become a saint. Housewives, priests, window washers, etc. all can be saints. So, then , we have the ability to discern evil from divine. That would be an judging someone to assume they can't discern evil from divine. Actually, that is an insult to Jesus because He gives those gifts of discernment to any soul who seeks the truth. The key is seeking the truth. That is the formula for the gift of discernment.
ReplyDeleteThank you Emmett for answering these posts. We have to pray the rosary and ask Jesus to help us discern everything that comes along our path to holiness. We have to spend time in Adoration of our Lord and ask him to guide us on the right path. The devil is afraid of the rosary, so whatever answer you get from the rosary is coming from God. The same goes for praying in front of the Blessed Sacrament.
ReplyDeleteProtestants threw away God's special gifts to the world- the Eucharist and the Blessed Mother. Catholics must not abuse these special gifts. Satan is fearful of these two gifts so use them for discernment. Satan cannot influence your mind when you pray before the Blessed Sacrament and during the recitation of the rosary.
Thank you for responding to my questions Emmett. Have you read Kelly Bowring's book "The Triumph of the Two Hearts"? If so, is your timeline of coming events similar to his?
ReplyDelete-Anonymous 1
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Emmett, I have just begun to read your post and find them to be very educational and important to our time. However, per your comment "Just a few notes on Maria Divine Mercy - this alleged seer teaches the doctrine of millenarianism (i.e. a future period of a thousand years of peace)"
ReplyDeletePlease read Fr. Joseph Iannuzzi's(OCS) books "The Triumph of God's Kingdom in the Millenium and End Times: A proper belief from the truth in Scripture and Church teachings" as well as "The Splendor of Creation". Fr. Iannuzzi is a good holy priest, has a Doctorate in Sacred theology, and is an exorcist. He was featured on Mother Angelica's program in the 90s to speak of the 'new era'.
The new era of peace, is what Maria Divine Mercy's messages also refer to, not millinerianism. She does not speak of Jesus walking about on earth.
Also, in response to negative references to Medjugorje in previous posts, by you and commenters: were it not for Our Lady of Medjugorje calling me to herself in Medjugorje, pointing the way to Jesus, I, a former atheist, would not have been in the Church since 1995, and neither would others in my life who experienced my conversion, and thus returned to the Sacraments, as former fallen away Catholics. None of us are mere pew-sitters but have been given many graces to become devout Catholics, attending daily Mass, frequent confession and holy hours of Adoration. And I am only one of millions who have been transformed through Medjugorje, as most people who return have a great impact on those in their lives, who also have converted. It has been 18 years for me, and many more years for others, which is a long time for a 'deception' to have brought about untold numbers of deep conversions and devout believers. Remember they accused Jesus of healing through Beelzebul "if satan drives out satan, he is divided againt himself..." (MT 12:26)
There are many apparitions and locutions and all have been utilized for different 'audiences' so to speak. Medjugorje is to bring people to God first, baby steps, then those converted can go on to more detailed messages that they then can be ready to receive.
Please do not inadvertently cause division by maintaining and promoting a narrow vision of various apparitions. Remember, you may prevent someone from conversion by interfering with God's work. The tongue is a dangerous weapon and more harm can come from stating opinions that may be erroneous, than remaining silent on things we are not sure about.
I have been very cautious for some time about MDM's messages, but through much prayer, I have received confirmations that they are valid. One message can be taken out of context if the whole is not discerned.
Gummy
If people are coming back to the Catholic church (because of apparitions or a visionary's messages) , going to confession, denouncing sin, praying for the dying and souls in purgatory, becoming more peaceful and less judgemental, living the gospel messages, etc. than those are good fruits and it can't possibly come from Satan.
ReplyDeleteI understand that many people here have very strong personal devotions, and I respect this very much. But personally, I am guarded against people who claim ongoing private revelations, because sometimes this can lead to schism. This has happened from the very earliest days of the Church, such as in the rise of Montanism, which even Tertullian was dragged into. Sometimes alleged seers with continuing alleged private revelations can suddenly turn against the Church, claiming that the pope isn't legimate etc - (Bayside comes to mind), then drag their followers into schism. So I try to stick to Church approved private revelations as best I can. I am open to Medjugorje being genuine, but I like to approach with caution. As Jamey says above, I think it takes indisputable miracles to prove the validity of apparitions, and until we have these, it is best to "be wise as serpents and innocent as doves" (Matt 10:16).
ReplyDeleteI did read Kelly Bowring's book when it first came out, but I can't really remember the sequence of events it details. I'll have to look over it again.
Jesus was born exactly on december 25th of the year 1.
ReplyDeleteThis was brilliantly demonstrated by MRS Henriette Marquebreucq-Horowitz in studying the Dead Sea scrolls
Just a reminder about private revelations. The Catholic Church, even in approved apparitions, such as Lourdes and Fatima, do NOT require any Catholic to believe in them per se. When our Lady says we must pray and fast and follow the Commandments this is already part of Catholic teaching. So, yes, we must believe that we must pray and fast according to the laws of the Church.
ReplyDeleteBut because these admonitions are already part of the deposit of faith, they are really nothing new. And as in Medjugorje, when our Lady calls us to pray and fast and follow the commandments this again is nothing new.
If someone finds the apparitions helpful to come back or deepen their faith, that's great. But, until they are officially approved by the Church (and that hasn't happened yet) then no one can be upset if someone else is more reserved in their judgment wether to believe or not. We can't judge or put down anyone who does not believe them. Coversely, if someone does believe them, then they are free to believe them as long as they don't deny any official Church teaching in doing so. One must be very discerning regarding these matters. Here's a great link that goes in to much more detail on this matter from a theologian on EWTN:
www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/apparitions.htm
Since the revelations of Medjugorje and Maria Divine Mercy are not approved (yet?) I would hope that we agree to disagree and respect those who want to follow the Church's present position on these and other revelations who have not yet been approved.
rose
Has anyone seen the documentary "Bethlehem Star" ? Excellent DVD. They calculate the year of His birth by recreating the exact position of the stars using a sophisticated astronomical computer program....
ReplyDeleteI have to examine my conscience very closely regarding my attitude towards private revelation - especially in light of your good posts. Pray for me.
ReplyDeleteWhat about The Marian Movement of Priests and Fr. Gobbi's locutions. Our Lady asked Fr. Gobbi to start the Marian Movement of Priests while he was praying at the Chapel of Apparitions at Fatima on May 8, 1972. The late Fr. Gobbi was very close to Blessed John Paul II.
ReplyDeleteI would like your thoughts.
I posted about the Star of Bethlehem documentary on this blog a few months ago.
ReplyDeleteI've always respected your approach to private revelations Terry. I often look to your writings to help with discernment.
I was led to accept Fr. Gobbi's locutions as genuine, because some of his material concerning the turn of the millennium matched my own research into this topic almost exactly. I was shocked when I first came across Fr. Gobbi's messages towards the end of writing my book. They are the only unapproved private revelations that I include in the book. But I felt compelled to do so because it so closely matched the findings of my own research.
The sad thing is that Fr. Gobbi's messages are rejected by many precisely because of his prophecies concerning the turn of the millennium.
For Terry Nelson-
ReplyDeleteI will pray for you today 2/16/13. I am confident about the authenticity of the Warning messages. I will ask Jesus to enlighten you about the messages. Sometimes Jesus lets me see things with "spiritual eyes". Two months ago He showed me Our Lady of Guadalupe. She was hovering above the universe and deep in prayer. I believe it is this particular image that will crush the head of the serpant. Then not too long after that, I sat down to recite some of the crusade prayers from the Warning Messages, and I could see that our Blessed Mother was waiting for me to pray them. I agree that we should ALL be vigilant concerning any messages from visionaries. But I am a prayerful person seeking the truth in all that I do and I would not promote these messages if Jesus didn't tell me to. Please pray for me and my family because we live in New York and our governor is going to make our state The Abortion Capital of the World!
"The Jewish custom of the Bar Mitzvah, is analogous to the sacrament of confirmation in Catholicism (when we receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit), given that both rituals are conferred around adolescence"
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure this follows, does it? Traditionally confirmation is supposed to be given earlier, after baptism. I has only been within the last 80 years or so that it was moved TI adolescence. At least traditionally, it would not be directly analogous to the bar mitzvah.
"glory of the olives"
ReplyDeleteActually "Gloria Olivae" is "Glory of the Olive" (singular). Plural would be "Gloria Olivarum", but this was what the prophecy recorded.
I have enjoyed reading your article and it is interesting to read the various comments.
ReplyDeleteI would just like to say, as has been stated in the comments, there has always been disagreement among Christians and their teachers about private revelations. It is recorded in the Bible that Christians were advised to take what is good (acceptable to church teaching) and leave the rest ie the dodgy stuff; which of course can be misinterpretation of individual souls.
It is interesting that you mention the Lords coming of age ceremony at 13. Medjugorje message at Christmas "I Am your peace, Keep My Commandments" just fits the bill for your own findings don't you think.
I was also fascinated that you should feel convinced about Fr Stefan Gobbi RIP. I too believe him to be the real deal. You must feel an empathy with those who do feel called to Faith by Medjugorje, or other messangers, surely, it is the heart that rules the head in these matters sometimes. With sincerity, charity and prayer. The Lord will judge by what is in our hearts, not our heads.
God bless, Julia.
I feel that people who, ever-so-kindly, hint that the Medjugorje apparitions may be dangerous, have unwittingly performed a 'spiritual abortion'. I literally feel that my very existence as a faithful Catholic has just been 'snuffed out' - along with a couple of million other people who have been privileged to experience a 'new life in Christ' through the assistance of Our Lady of Medjugorje and other apparitions and locutions from Heaven. How could we faithful Catholics possibly continue to grow and spread the good news, based upon a sham - a lie? You are, in essence, denying our very existence as newborn Catholics, just as surely as the world continues to deny the existence of human beings in the womb; and therefore we/they are not real. Perhaps we are figments of our own imaginations?
ReplyDeleteThe help which Heaven (ie: God - Father, Son, Holy Spirit; and Mary) is sending to the poor lost sheep of this generation, consists of more than merely an opinion (or 'choice'). It is a matter of reality. The reality of true, long lasting, conversions. When you consider the number of 'pew-sitters'- Catholics in name only - and see how devout the converted masses of people are, the closed mindedness toward apparitions is mind-boggling. Confessions abound in Medjugorje. Priests say confessions like this they have never heard! Please meditate on the absurdity of the following idea: the devil has, for 31 years, brought some millions of people to the Lord, as lovers of true Catholic teachings, who have experienced spiritual rebirth?? We were spiritually formed in the womb of our Mother, the Blessed Virgin Mary, prepared and presented to the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, by the power of the Holy Spirit, and you can credit all this to the work of an evil entity?? Again, I repeat, "if satan drives out satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand???" [Mt 12:26]
In light of all these facts and actual human life changing experiences, is the devil's work in all this to be considered even a remote possibility? I know that the Pharisees who said, "This man drives out demons only by the power of Beelzebul, the prince of darkness." [Mt 12:24] did not accept nor recognize the miraculous work of God, and unfortunately this shortsightedness continues today. "Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters." [Mt 12:30] Fear which comes from the devil, has infected so many good Catholics. Early on after my conversion through Medjugorje, I was given good advice. Pray for Wisdom, Knowledge, Understanding and Discernment. I did so, even though I did not know what they meant, and I believe that what we ask for is given.
(contd)
I am 66 years old but I truly came into 'being' 18 years ago, literally re-born. My life is 180 degrees different. My story reminds people of the swiftness of St. Paul's conversion. One day I did not believe, the next day I knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that God exists and I was hungry for the Truth that I had not known all my life. I have not stopped pursuing that Truth no matter the cost. All the other people who have experienced what I did have a similar story. When statements like "Catholics are not required to believe even in approved apparitions" are repeated over and over again, especially when so many people have experienced true conversion, you are summarily denying our existence. If you were to delete all the people who have had conversions through apparitions from the statistics showing practicing, devout, Catholics who believe in the True Presence and all the Sacraments, you will arrive at a fraction of that number. This is why Our Lord and Blessed Mother have been working so hard to bring about conversions. In answer to Our Lord's question "will I find any faith on earth when I return?" - a resounding YES, because our Faith has been built upon a solid foundation. The Blessed Mother taught me everything I know. And we DO exist whether you believe it or not.
ReplyDeleteI truly know how the aborted babies must feel. I believe the Lord has given me this painful understanding, because I, unfortunately, had an abortion 35 years ago, and now I know how my child must have felt. I was eliminating a problem - he or she was not acknowledged as a person. It is everyone's decision to be spiritually pro-choice; or to be spiritually pro-life! God has not stopped working through and with His people. Miracles still happen. We either have faith the size of a mustard seed, or we do not. I have literally seen mountains moved, for which I will be forever grateful to Our Lady of Medjugorje and her determination to bring Her children to Her Son!
God bless, Gummy
Emmett,
ReplyDeleteThe discussion of Pope Benedict being the martyred Pope, it seems too late. Is it Peter the Roman or Benedict XVI who goes to Jerusalem? I am wondering since reading messages at
http://www.locutions.org/
Check the homepage, you'll see the 3rd Secret and two messages and on the same page read the Summary of World Events Locutions. According to these messages, God is going bring a great good out of an evil.
The discussion about Maria of Divine Mercy (Ireland). Maria is
the ONLY current messenger hearing
the next Pope is NOT good, he is
the False Prophet and makes me question whether Maria is a true messenger?
Hi Anon,
ReplyDeleteThere are many reasons not to believe in MDM's messages - the fact that she claims the next pope will be the False Prophet is one of the best ones.
Emmett,
ReplyDeleteJesus said you should remain silent about any visionary's messages that you disagree with. You are not remaining silent. You should say, "I'm not sure about the messages and perhaps you should pray about them." You don't know for a fact if they or true or not.
If these prophecies are false (which I have a hard time believing in them due to doctrinal errors) then ones who truly believe in them will be lead into schism over the fact they believe the next pope will be a false prophet. That is the danger Emmett is trying to point out.
ReplyDeleteNobody can stop you from believing these messages but be VERY careful and gaurd your faith as with all Private Revelation. If they prove to be false would you still cling to them? Will you be able to discern if the next Pope is valid?
This is serious business. I recall "False apparitions" widely believed that Benedict XVI was to be a false pope. Schism is caused very easily this way, and Satan is very deceptive. He also can come as an "Angel of Light" please be careful, that is all Emmett is saying
Just remember that the foundation of our faith is the Deposit of Faith--Scripture and Apostolic Tradition, NOT private revelations (even approved ones).
ReplyDeleteThe MDM private revelations are false. How do we know? Because they contradict infallible dogma, against which we must test and measure any seer's revelations.
The fact that some MDM supporters are already calling those of us who have reservations (and with good reason) "spiritual abortionists" already shows the divisive nature of such false revelations.
And as far as Medjugorje goes:
"The phenomenon is not officially approved by the Catholic Church.Bishop Ratko Perić of the diocese of Mostar-Duvno, responsible for Medjugorje, has stated, "The numerous absurd messages, lies, falsehoods and disobedience associated from the beginning with the events and "apparitions" of Medjugorje, all refute every claim of authenticity."
Fr. Tomislav Vlasic, one of the main publicizers of the apparitions, was DEFROCKED by Pope Benedict XVI in July 2009. He had been accused of sexual misconduct, "dubious doctrine, the manipulation of consciences, suspect mysticism and disobedience towards legitimately issued orders""
Joe,
ReplyDeleteYou're not dealing with a fool. Time will tell about the Warning messages. If you pray, know the dogmas of the church, then you will be able to discern about our new pope. If the new pope keeps true to the true presence of the Eucharist and is faithful to the dogmas then that would be favorable. As I said, time will tell. But I have to be honest with you, God has been sending me many signs that these messages are divine. Pray, pray and pray about them! Yes, this is serious business! I know they may seem hard to believe, that we could have a false prophet in the Vatican, but it is the work of the antichrist. Unfortunatly, this must occur but we know who will win in the end.
I never thought I was dealing with a fool. I was just making a point. May God bless you and your family and may St. Michael protect and guide you and yours in these tough times.
ReplyDeletePeace
Joe,
ReplyDeleteAnd God Bless you and your family. I do say the St. Michael prayer everyday and I hope you do, too. Evil is rampant, more than any other time in history. Keep close watch on the selection of the new pope and if he goes against the dogmas of the true church do not accept him. Pray to Jesus for direction! Pray often in front of the Blessed Sacrament. Pray the rosary everyday, if you can. It would be wise to study the Baltimore Catechism.
I think you have to respect there are many who will disagree with MDM and/or Medjugorje because there are very real problems associated and simply there are so many contradictions within themselves and ultimately with church teaching as well. I see huge red flags with both.
ReplyDeleteI personally think there is a huge danger to put too much stock in them and as a result it feels like a "spiritual abortion" has taken place when people disagree. This is not a pleasant feeling as I have been through it before myself when certain beliefs I had were questioned.
Emmett may be able to enlighten me but there was a supposed apparition to a guy at a church somewhere (on a Spanish Island I think) and people were performing huge prayer vigils there, penances etc and eventually the guy receiving the "apparition" declared himself the true pope and they went into schism.
I wish someone would comment about
ReplyDeletehttp://www.locutions.org/
The prophecy of the Pope being killed in Jerusalem which will help bring about the conversion of Israel.
On MDM again. Maria is the only prophet saying the next Pope is bad, specifically, he is the False Prophet.
I was converted by private revelation so I have a respect for
the messengers. It's happened more
than once, you read a line in Maria's messages that does not sound Catholic. Maybe, Our Lord is
revealing something new...I make the excuse. But this makes no sense, everyone else is wrong but Maria is correct, the next Pope is not holy, he is the False Prophet? No.
And look, even in this excerpt, the
words about St. Peter! And to say
"INTERPRETED BY MY MANY CHURCHES."
Jesus established one Church not
many.
excerpt from the April 12, 2012 message to Maria of Divine Mercy
+ + +
...The truth of My Scripture, contained in the Book of Revelation, has been interpreted by My many churches. So many variations, all of which are based on human interpretation.
My beloved Pope Benedict XVI is the LAST TRUE POPE on this earth.
Peter the Roman, is My Peter, the original apostle who will rule My Church from the Heavens under the command of My Eternal Father. Then, when I come to reign, at the Second Coming, he will rule over all of God’s children when all religions will become one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.
I only speak the truth My daughter.
I must warn you that many new self-proclaimed prophets will now emerge, who will contradict My Holy Word given to you, the end time true prophet.
First they will convince believers that their words come from Me.
Their words will be carefully chosen and their meaning will be vague and a little confusing. But many will dismiss this weakness and embrace their messages because they seem to be in line with Holy Scripture.
When many souls have been seduced, the attack will begin.
They, My daughter, are being sent to prepare God’s children to accept the NEXT POPE, who comes after My beloved Vicar Pope Benedict. This Pope may be elected by members within the Catholic Church BUT HE WILL BE THE FALSE
PROPHET.
His electors are wolves in sheep’s clothing and are members of the secret Masonic and evil group led by Satan...
http://www.thewarningsecondcoming.com/
Jesus said, "The truth of My Scripture, contained in the Book of Revelation, has been interpreted by My many churches. So many variations, all of which are based on human interpretation." What I am understanding from this "Many churches" is that the Catholic church and the 45,000 Protestant churches all preach about the Book of Revelations. Jesus loves the Protestants, too even though it is not the True church. Have you read about LaSalette? Our Blessed Mother predicted at LaSalette, "Rome will lose the faith and become the seat of the antichrist. This message has also been given at Akita- 1. message regarding a terrible punishment for humanity 2. the devil will infiltrate the Church. Also, the messgaes of Fatima are the same messages of Akita. On Oct. 13, 1977, Pope Paul VI told the world, "The tail of the devil is functioning in the disintegration of the Catholic world. The darkness of Satan has entered and spread throughout the Catholic Church even to its summit. Apostasy, the loss of the faith, is spreading throughout the world and into the highest levels within the Church."
ReplyDeleteYou may want to read the book, "Thunder of Justice".
Jesus told MDM that He was giving her messages that He has not revealed to other prophets. The Church never fully disclosed the Third Secret of Fatima. That is why the Blessed Mother appeared to the four young girls in Garabandal Spain. As I have said time and time again, pray about the authenticity of the messages. Start a nine day novena on the holy rosary. Do not rely on your own intellect to discern these messages.
Hi,
ReplyDeleteI appreciate your post and don't wish to argue, our prayers for all the current messengers.
"INTERPRETED BY MY MANY CHURCHES", it doesn't sound right, Protestantism is man-made, there is one Church, one faith.
I agree, Satan wishes to take down the faith and he is trying but the teachings of the faith are God's
Truth, they have never changed.
And my question again, Maria of Divine Mercy is the ONLY messenger
hearing the next Pope is not good,
he is the False Prophet. It is a too important a claim to ignore.
See: http://warningsecondcoming.blogspot.ca/
There are fifty MDM quotes (in bold) questioned. I wish Maria to
be a true prophet but come on, 50 is lot not to line up with the teachings of the faith.
Did you see the lightening that struck the Vatican the same day the pope resigned? A 4.8 earthquake hit Rome a few days later. A coincidence? Read message about pope from Christina Gallagher. Go to christinagallagher.org. Message from Jan. 26, 2013. Christina is a visionary with the sigmata.
ReplyDeleteThere are so few TRUE Catholics today. Jesus has been guiding me to the TRUE Catholics to converse with in these times. Something BIG is going to happen with the Catholic Church, but the TRUE Catholics will always be together worshiping even if we will have to practice our Faith in each other's homes or some other place. Jesus is offended by us receiving the Eucharist in our hands. We must receive him in our mouths. Also, Jesus does not want Eucharistic ministers to hand out the Eucharist. May the Lord have mercy on those Catholics who voted for Obama. I happen to know many of them!
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteEmmett:
"The more I study, the more I find that both Scripture and Tradition (as well as approved private revelations), are all singularly clear that the Church must undergo a final passion after the Second Pentecost, which WILL LEAD TO THE END OF THE WORLD. The Second Pentecost will come to strengthen us for the final hour, when the Church will be crucified under the new Nero. But the Second Pentecost will not remain for a thousand years. Christ states that once the Gospel is proclaimed to all nations in the Second Pentecost, then the end will come:"...
I love the discussion and your blog Emmett but I can't believe you disagree with Father Iannuzzi?
The messages from Heaven have said
for years, Jesus is not returning in His person "soon" as some believe, His reign is going to be spiritual during the Millennium, the new time of God, it is the Eucharistic reign of Our Lord Jesus Christ. St. Bernard said Jesus' "middle coming" is
spiritual. There will be divine signs and wonders during the Great
Tribulation and during the Millennium, however long it is...
The world doesn't go from the Second Pentecost (the Great Warning and after bringing people to the faith), the Church and her Passion/Calvary and next comes the end of the world.
We're near the end of the 6th Day, the prophesied Great Warning is "soon" which includes God's warning of the anti-Christ and his evil. God protects the Remnant during the Anti-Christ's persecution. After the Chastisement, God renews the earth, God's 7th Day is the millennial reign of Christ. The 8th Day, the last battle with Satan and Our Lord returns for the Final Judgment.
Emmitt,
ReplyDeleteThank you for your blog! I believe the two witnesses are Emaritus Pope B16 and Pope Francis. Bergoglio means "mount of olives" by the way. :)
about MDM and prayer:
ReplyDeleteI'm an ex-Mormon who, by the grace of God, was received into the Catholic Church on Easter 2012. When I was a Mormon missionary (trying to convert Catholics - God forgive me!), we would give people a Book of Mormon, ask them to read it, and pray to God about whether it was true or not. And sure enough, some people felt that God was telling them it was true and so they abandoned apostolic Christianity for Mormonism.
I'm not saying that we shouldn't pray for discernment on private revelation. We should always pray about everything. But I do think we should not rely totally on perceived spiritual feelings to discern the truth. God also gave us his Church and the gift of reason.
Wise words anon! Some people tend to find signs in everything, and end up seeing only what they want to see. I think that any important private revelation that God wants to draw our attention to will be accompanied by a spectacular public miracle.
ReplyDeleteIt's ok to have a passing interest in other private revelations - but they need to be treated with a huge amount of caution, and we should never allow ourselves to be completely absorbed in any of them.
Obviously you have not been reading THE BOOK OF TRUTH - THE WARNING
ReplyDeleteIn the messages, one year before to the day 11 February 2012, Jesus told us that Pope Benedict will be ousted from the Holy See in Rose
http://www.thewarningsecondcoming.com/
we are living the end time. Read messages daily given to us daily by God the Father, Jesus and His Blessed Mother.
the Book of Truth is mention in the bible Daniel 10.21
Archbishop Murray Chatlain will become the next Pope after Pope Francis is killed by Islamic terrorists. He is the "Angelic Pope" that was foreseen by Catholic saints and mystics that will guide the Church during its time of tibulation and triumph.
ReplyDeleteHe is the youngest Bishop as foretold by Catholic Saints and Mystics.
ReplyDelete"Do not rely on your own intellect to discern these messages."... ironic, this is exactly why we must reserve judgement and rely on those with spiritual protection from error to decide what is authentic i.e. the Magisterium. Even on these few comments I can see bad fruit by supporters of unapproved apparitions demonizing those who reserve judgement as practitioners of "spiritual abortion", which incidentally is a horrible term that makes light of the gravity of actual abortion in using it. Shame on you! And God bless you, Emmett, you are truly letting yourself be guided by the Truth.
rereading this with what is about to happen in Cuba with Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill and Pope Francis about to meet, in this year of Mercy.
ReplyDeleteHoly Spirit unite us and destroy satan's reign of the last 100 yrs.
ReplyDeleteThe living Messiah is truly here...testimonyofthetwowitnesses.com
I promise with all of my heart , all breath I take my life and soul,
Knowing what that promise means, which I don't take lightly
that Holy Father Pope Peter the last and his wife Mary Romanus
are truly the brother and sister of Christ! When writing to Pope
Peter and Mary ones heart and soul is dicerned right from the
thrown in Heaven! He is the living earthly Messiah also He
Is the great Catholic monarch along with King Jesus Who
IS coming back at His third coming! Out of Jesus great love
and mercy the unborn babies of abortion are coming back
too they have true parents who want them and love them
Oh Holy Father and Mary Romanus are so good!
The little flock as long as they Do all that King Jesus
and our True Pope growing in virtue and humility and
Obediance and persevere in doing so will not only
Reverse age but shall not die also! Mary was never
Separated fro God , She was there from the start
, She was United in the sufferings and death of her son
and She is now United in the hearts of Holy Father
Petrus Romanus and His wife Mary through the
because the Sacred Hearts are right in them!
Sadly to say most all will reject then and rehang
Jesus on the Cross again through the rejection
of His True brother and sister! They people
must choose between the Word which never
changes and which is living write in His Testimony
and Heart of His two witnesses and true little flock
Or between the anti Christ who will mimic all that
Jesus did in His life! Obama and Francis are the
two beast spoken of in the bible and it has
Been revealed from Heaven Obama's third term
is fixed!
Jesus let me hold Him right in my dream He
Is so beautiful and handsome so peaceful no
words can describe! He was good to me
To let me experience a communion with the
unborn babies ! Hell is very real too I disobeyed
His Testimony and experienced excruciating
pains of hell! It was so scary!
The little flower answered my prayers too
about His Testimnoy! I truly hope you
Pray about it too before you Jesus turn
Jesus away righting you ,
His eyes get so sad like hurting ones
best friend from what I saw in my dream.
Most people didn't want Jesus as a infant
Most didn't want His death and sacrifice
and sadly to say they are doing it all over
again by spitting on Him and His true brother
and sister and true little flock! He is hidden
in His Word for they can't handle His Just
Anger! Oh my gosh it truly take a lot to
have Him get to Just Anger! Our nation
Flunked as a whole , and until are nation
Humbles itself to His two witnesses and
Repentance they shall reap what they so!
For Obama is not going to end tell the people choose!
PS. Please watch!!
http://youtu.be/8j8nu9sd-WE
http://youtu.be/6tBpQNgWiy4